Armchair climatologists debunking climatology

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• citizenschallenge

  September 2016

  just tossing out some random thoughts on this one.
  
  

  tadaaa said:
  I think the wider point is that Climate Science is both extremely accessible and extremely relevant/important
  
  This inevitably means you get the armchair “experts” continually second guessing the science with varying levels of in-expertise -- also bringing a whole host of preconceived ideas and biases that tragically (and comically) they simply won’t let go of ...

  Perhaps rather than focusing on obviously contrived and erroneous arguments -
  confront their absolutism, ...
  or their lack of interest in learning about details they haven't taken into account yet, ...
  or ask them what makes them think they are smarter than full-time experts working in the field, ...
  and so on.  
  
  explore their intellectual landscape (or lack their of) like a science project, ...
  Or a comedy project.
  
  

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• tadaaa

  September 2016 edited September 2016

  
   
  "Perhaps rather than focusing on obviously contrived and erroneous arguments -
  confront their absolutism, ...
  or their lack of interest in learning about details they haven't taken into account yet, ...
  or ask them what makes them think they are smarter than full-time experts working in the field, ...
  and so on."  
  
  If I think they are conversing in good faith - and genuinely want to further their understanding of the subject,  I do engage and try and get to the bottom of their issues with climate science

  and it is always useful for the lurkers (research has shown the only 5 to 10% of viewers actively post on threads)

  often the objections of the genuinely curious are along the lines I have previously posted i.e. that the scientists have always "got their bases covered", climate science is like "nailing jelly to a wall"

  this comes from not understanding the basics and buying into a few headline myths

  that sea level video is actually a good one - I have had people post in response to it things like "wow I have learnt something new" etc etc

  but if it becomes clear they are just trying to endlessly resurrect zombie arguments - I simply make fun of them and call them out as conspiracy theorist and deniers

  but unfortunately I am NOT a scientist so i try not to get into the weeds with all the statistics/maths etc

  I suffer from a sort of reverse dunning kruger - in that I am acutely aware of my own limitations in that department

  
  

  
  

  
  

  
  

  
  

  
  

  
  
  

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• FlyingDutchman

  September 2016

  tadaaa said:

  I suffer from a sort of reverse dunning kruger - in that I am acutely aware of my own limitations in that department
  

  That's not reverse Dunning-Kruger, that's either common sense. Insofar as that particular kind of sense is 'common' nowadays, at least. You might not be a scientist but you've got the first requirement down just fine: know there's always more to learn.
  

  

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• citizenschallenge

  September 2016

  FlyingDutchman said:

  tadaaa said:

  I suffer from a sort of reverse dunning kruger - in that I am acutely aware of my own limitations in that department
  

  That's not reverse Dunning-Kruger, that's either common sense. Insofar as that particular kind of sense is 'common' nowadays, at least. You might not be a scientist but you've got the first requirement down just fine: know there's always more to learn.
  

  Add to that the ability to accept the considered opinion of the expert community - er, that respecting consensus thing.  And of course curiosity to learn about what we don't understand and ability to handle corrections, and willingness to learn from our mistakes.    
  
  Back to that inner-landscape thing.  For me, I have a personal visceral relationship with this planet - so part of me is deeply offended by what we have allowed to happen this past half century.  I'm flabbergasted and gobsmacked that grown up people can seriously believe the bull puckie they spew.  I keep getting led astray by this old personal notion that there must a conscious inside people - though it seems useless your upbringing imbibes one with a sense of intellectual honesty it's not there, I keep hoping it's not.  
  
  I struggle with trying to grasp what's going on inside those heads, which is why I tend to be more aggressive in some of my writing particularly when I'm dissecting some contrarian propaganda piece.  
  
  Guess I'm also hugely offended at how contrarians taunt serious and very busy scientists for not participating in their kangaroo debates - yet run from all serious critics and invitation for debates they receive, mine and others.  Trying to figure out how that sort of mentality justifies itself.  Or at least expose it - such as with my Virtual Debates. 

  

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• John Seers

  October 2016

  ""don't tend to remain easily publicly accessible once they've seriously gone down in flames. They just kind of disappear""
  
  In other words the only models he can access at this time are those that are working well and have not gone down in flames. Seems like he shoots himself in the foot there. 
  

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